[ThePresident777]

Is there a way to rebuild Geralt, to change talent point assignments?

[GoodGuyA]

Only one. If you pick up the quest From a Bygone Era, which starts when you pick up an Encrypted Message in a haunted home, and you take it back to Dethmold only to keep it. In Act 3 you can talk with Bras Ban Ard to further the quest, and eventually make your way to the Loc Muinne sewers. After answering the password and solving the puzzle, you will meet a figure called The Operator, and if you talk to him correctly you will be able to reallocate your talents. Only once, and only if you decide not to meddle with him.

[Random drowner]

I found the manuscript by chance when exploring on the other side of the mist (on Iorveths path). Thus I had no reason or opportunity to take it to Deathmold. Ban ard gave me info on how to use it though.

[ThePresident777]

Strange that no one would have created a mod for this by now.

[.Volsung.]

You can get the scroll on any path. You don't *have* to take it to Dethmold, that is only part of a quest on Roche's path. As long as you show it to the Bras of Ban Ard, you'll have a way to meet the Operator.

The Witcher 2 is not that long for (old-school at least) computer RPG standards. And you can't really mess up your build so much that Geralt is useless. I don't think a re-spec mod is necessary.

[Seboist]

Random drowner said:

I found the manuscript by chance when exploring on the other side of the mist (on Iorveths path). Thus I had no reason or opportunity to take it to Deathmold. Ban ard gave me info on how to use it though. ›››

Giving it to Dethmold voids your opportunity to respec Geralt.

[Guy N'wah]

Seboist said:

Giving it to Dethmold voids your opportunity to respec Geralt. ›››

You can take it to Dethmold and ask him about it. Then you get a choice of selling it to him or keeping it. But you're right: selling it to him closes this quest line; you must keep it.

[ThePresident777]

.Volsung. said:

You can get the scroll on any path. You don't *have* to take it to Dethmold, that is only part of a quest on Roche's path. As long as you show it to the Bras of Ban Ard, you'll have a way to meet the Operator.

The Witcher 2 is not that long for (old-school at least) computer RPG standards. And you can't really mess up your build so much that Geralt is useless. I don't think a re-spec mod is necessary. ›››

It's not about the possibility of making Geralt useless or not. It's about playing how I prefer.

[Guy N'wah]

ThePresident777 said:

It's not about the possibility of making Geralt useless or not. It's about playing how I prefer. ›››

In that case, you have one way of respec'ing Geralt, and it's that way or the highway... A key characteristic of this game is that you must make choices earlier in the game and live with the consequences of those choices later. I am against any changes to the game that would compromise that.

But when we start seeing mods made with REDKit, I would be surprised if there weren't a "respec Geralt anytime" mod among the earliest ones.

[Wut the Melon]

I don't think a respec mod is possible with just xml editing, which is the only thing we can do currently. As Guy said, maybe with the REDKit, though I still have no idea how much more the REDKit is than a simple level editor...

[ThePresident777]

Guy N said:

In that case, you have one way of respec'ing Geralt, and it's that way or the highway... A key characteristic of this game is that you must make choices earlier in the game and live with the consequences of those choices later. I am against any changes to the game that would compromise that.
›››

That would make sense if your build choices were part of the story, but, they are not. Nobody is going to know or care or remember if your witcher was a sword swinger or a sign maker or a bomber or a trapper or whatever. Your character's build is in no way reflected in the journal which tells the story of your witcher and your journal is not posted online for people to read the story of your witcher. It's pointless to be so tyranical about what other people do in the privacy of their PC as they involve no one but themselves.

[SlimeDynamiteD]

Tyranical? Isn't that a bit radical?

I mean normally players upgrade the skills they think are useful to them in which case they won't have to respec.

And when you do make a mistake by accidentaly upgrading a skill you didn't want, the game isn't unforgiving that the consequences are extreme and let's you respec near the end.

[Random drowner]

ThePresident777 said:

That would make sense if your build choices were part of the story, but, they are not. Nobody is going to know or care or remember if your witcher was a sword swinger or a sign maker or a bomber or a trapper or whatever. Your character's build is in no way reflected in the journal which tells the story of your witcher and your journal is not posted online for people to read the story of your witcher. It's pointless to be so tyranical about what other people do in the privacy of their PC as they involve no one but themselves. ›››

I agree so far that your choices regarding skill is merely a function of gameplay. Geralt is for example, not really a newbie witcher in the beginning of W2, even though he is skill and stat-wise (but that is just because the game is designed according to certain old - and obsolete if you ask me - game conventions, just like most games).

[Aaden]

Random drowner said:

I agree so far that your choices regarding skill is merely a function of gameplay. Geralt is for example, not really a newbie witcher in the beginning of W2, even though he is skill and stat-wise (but that is just because the game is designed according to certain old - and obsolete if you ask me - game conventions, just like most games). ›››

How is character progression obsolete?

For many seeing their character become more and more powerful is a core motivational element in RPGs. In fact, this factor is so important that it spread to other genres and lead to multiplayer games including level ups and unlocks. It's so popular that entire games, namely MMOs, are built around character progression.



Edit: On-topic: Even if it doesn't affect the story or anything, having no way to reset your skills is still part of the concept that choices matter and should be made with consideration. It's also part of the replay value and specializing is part of the fun. The argument of "it's just me, my game and on my PC" is sort of killing any discussion - with the same argument you might demand race cars to be included in TW2, because maybe you'd rather race through muddy tracks in the woods of Flotsam than hunt down a Kingslayer; it's a dev teams job to decide what is to be in the game and what isn't, they spend a considerable amount of time for figuring out what they want and why. And your not liking their decisions has absolutely nothing to do with tyranny.

[Random drowner]

Aaden said:

How is character progression obsolete?

For many seeing their character become more and more powerful is a core motivational element in RPGs. In fact, this factor is so important that it spread to other genres and lead to multiplayer games including level ups and unlocks. It's so popular that entire games, namely MMOs, are built around character progression.



Edit: On-topic: Even if it doesn't affect the story or anything, having no way to reset your skills is still part of the concept that choices matter and should be made with consideration. It's also part of the replay value and specializing is part of the fun. The argument of "it's just me, my game and on my PC" is sort of killing any discussion - with the same argument you might demand race cars to be included in TW2, because maybe you'd rather race through muddy tracks in the woods of Flotsam than hunt down a Kingslayer; it's a dev teams job to decide what is to be in the game and what isn't, they spend a considerable amount of time for figuring out what they want and why. And your not liking their decisions has absolutely nothing to do with tyranny. ›››

I was not clear enough it seems. Character progression is not obsolete, on the contrary. But it needs to be integrated in the story and character to begin with. For example: Geralt is already a master swordman. There is no real good reason why he should not be able to riposte or parry effectively in any build. However character progression could be him talking to, for example, a member from another witcher school and train with this character to learn a new move they do not train in the wolf school. Similarly, Geralt and Triss could spend time together to train Geralt in using his signs more efficiently and possible some more advanced spells (like for example the "heliptrope sign" which in reality is not a the heliotrope sign at all, but a time-manipulation spell by the looks of it)

[ThePresident777]

SlimeDynamiteD said:

Tyranical? Isn't that a bit radical?

I mean normally players upgrade the skills they think are useful to them in which case they won't have to respec.

And when you do make a mistake by accidentaly upgrading a skill you didn't want, the game isn't unforgiving that the consequences are extreme and let's you respec near the end. ›››

You are missing the point. It is nobody's business what I do in isolation.

[ThePresident777]

Aaden said:

Edit: On-topic: Even if it doesn't affect the story or anything, having no way to reset your skills is still part of the concept that choices matter and should be made with consideration. It's also part of the replay value and specializing is part of the fun. The argument of "it's just me, my game and on my PC" is sort of killing any discussion - with the same argument you might demand race cars to be included in TW2, because maybe you'd rather race through muddy tracks in the woods of Flotsam than hunt down a Kingslayer; it's a dev teams job to decide what is to be in the game and what isn't, they spend a considerable amount of time for figuring out what they want and why. And your not liking their decisions has absolutely nothing to do with tyranny. ›››

Yeah, choices matter so much that I can't make them. I can't chose to respec my character even though his talents progressions has nothing to do with the story which is where choices are supposed to matter. I don't have enough information about how the game works to consider my choices, yet, my choices are supposed to matter. I don't know who my choices matter to when nobody has any connection to them whatsoever. If choices matter then I can choose what I want otherwise choice is being mocked.

If you think I'm going to replay the same story just to try a new build, you are mistaken. Character building does not make a story replayable when character building has nothing to do with the story.

It's a dev teams job to make a game that players will be satisfied with when they play the game. I'm having difficulty being satisfied with TW2 because of these broken notions of choice.

[Guy N'wah]

Maybe the developers intended that the only way to respec your character be one that is provided in the story.

The way that is provided is a sound one, not a broken one at all.

It is not a development team's job to cater to just any request for a feature irrelevant to the game they intended to deliver.

[ThePresident777]

Guy N said:

Maybe the developers intended that the only way to respec your character be one that is provided in the story.

The way that is provided is a sound one, not a broken one at all.

It is not a development team's job to cater to just any request for a feature irrelevant to the game they intended to deliver. ›››

Exactly, the devolopers can intend to create a game that I enjoy in which case it will include unlimited character respecs. And if you don't like that, then, you can be the one to take it or leave it.

The respec provided in TW2 is as relevant to the story as a character repec potion or button. It's given the appearance of a story element but it's just a cover. They could have saved themselves some time by just providing a respec button in the menu. At least it would have been an honest acknowledgment that the character development mechanism has no story relation at all and it is just another arbitrary mechanism.

As a matter of fact, if I could grant Geralt max level at the very start of the game, I would. That is how important the whole "character development" or "character progression" mechanism is to me in enjoying a game such as TW2. I'd essentially be granting myself the fireworks show I want to see.

[the Fixer]

ThePresident777 said:

Exactly, the devolopers can intend to create a game that I enjoy in which case it will include unlimited character respecs. And if you don't like that, then, you can be the one to take it or leave it.

The respec provided in TW2 is as relevant to the story as a character repec potion or button. It's given the appearance of a story element but it's just a cover. They could have saved themselves some time by just providing a respec button in the menu. At least it would have been an honest acknowledgment that the character development mechanism has no story relation at all and it is just another arbitrary mechanism.

As a matter of fact, if I could grant Geralt max level at the very start of the game, I would. That is how important the whole "character development" or "character progression" mechanism is to me in enjoying a game such as TW2. I'd essentially be granting myself the fireworks show I want to see. ›››

By this logic they could have just given you all the swords in the game at the beginning. Finding a sword in a cave is completely irrelevant to the story of The Witcher 2, so why making it realistic? The developers would have spared a lot of time with a "give me all the swords" button in the menu. The cave could look like a story element, but it would be just a cover.

Fact is, the developers obviously didn't want to give you all the swords, because you have to find them to enjoy them. Same thing with skills. Nobody told you what you should or shouldn't do in your game, it's up to your personal tastes. But if what you want isn't in the game beacause it would break the gameplay as it was intended to be, you shouldn't blame the developers. Someone will probably make a mod for it when it'll be possible. It would surely make more sense than having Triss walk around naked all the time, if you ask me.