[VonStreff]

There's a new online magazine coming along in April! It's very cheap, but needs your support to start up. http://www.kickstart...amer-magazine-0

If it's not for you, that's all good, but maybe you have a few friends who would be interested?

[RSIK4]

keep up the good work ....

[Chromie92]

Since when did Legend of Zelda become an Arpg let alone an rpg?

[arkblazer]

I always considered zelda an rpg, it has all the elements.

[guipit]

Chromie92 said:

Since when did Legend of Zelda become an Arpg let alone an rpg? ›››

Everyone has their own definition of what an RPG is, some say Heavy Rain was because of C&C.

[Chromie92]

guipit said:

Everyone has their own definition of what an RPG is, some say Heavy Rain was because of C&C. ›››

But the Zelda games never had any C&C whatsoever. We never actually make a single decision in any Zelda game and I say this as someone who's played nearly every game in the franchise since I was a young child.

[freakie1one]

I'd say Zelda is an RPG simply because there is a story that is unfolding while you role-play as a character in that story. Granted, I haven't played all the Zelda games. I've only played the one on SNES and Gameboy. I'd say it falls under the "action RPG" genre.

[Pangaea]

I'd probably call Zelda adventure actually. Have only played one of them though, about that sleeping egg or whatever it was on some dream island - on my old Gameboy. Was a great game. Oh, how I struggled in some of those last level dungeons :|

[freakie1one]

Adventure game also would accurately describe Zelda. I've never been one to be picky over what genre or category a game falls under because ultimately I consider it to be of little consequence

[arkblazer]

Chromie92 said:

But the Zelda games never had any C&C whatsoever. We never actually make a single decision in any Zelda game and I say this as someone who's played nearly every game in the franchise since I was a young child. ›››

You haven't played many jrpgs have you?

zelda does have some, in the first one you have the choice of which place to go, what dungeon to visit etc. etc... hell zelda could be considered one of the first sandbox rpg's

[Chromie92]

arkblazer said:

You haven't played many jrpgs have you?

Alot actually some of my favorite games like Vagrant Story and Chrono Trigger are well jrpgs it's the only reason I own a Playstation just so I can play some good jrpgs.

arkblazer said:

zelda does have some, in the first one you have the choice of which place to go, what dungeon to visit etc. etc... hell zelda could be considered one of the first sandbox rpg's ›››

The original could be considered a sandbox sure but I wouldn't rpg. We never get to roleplay well anything. There has never been C&C like in western games or leveling of skills like in every jrpg (I guess Zelda II) and after Zelda II every Zelda game has follow a linear dungeon progression. I never get to choose to side with Ganon or have a way to save the Great Deku Tree. I love the Zelda series but come on they are action/adventure games if anything.

[.Volsung.]

Sigh... here we go again. We all have our own expectations or ideas about what an RPG should be, but I'm pretty sure Zelda cannot be one unless we have a VERY twisted perception of role-playing.

"Playing a character over a story" defines pretty much every modern video game. I suppose playing as Sub-Zero in, say Mortal Kombat II all the way form start to finish makes it an RPG: he has a background story, personal motivations and tries to accomplish a goal. We have the option of choosing what moves to perform and even how to finish each combatant. A streak of fatalities marks us as a vicious warrior, and by the time we reach Shao Kahn we fulfill our goals and become the hero of... err... Mortal Kombat? What about Batman Arkham series? Those even have unlockable upgrades/perks!

So no, in my personal opinion Zelda was never a ROLE-PLAYING game. Nothing you do affects the course of the story or the world around you. Choosing where to go first is about as "role-playing" as choosing which weapon to use in a first-person shooter.

Sword and sorcery or high fantasy, upgradable talents, numerical attributes, leveling up, none of these things mean anything about role-playing. The fact that most role-playing games rely on features such as these to define their characters and gameworld are entirely circumstantial.

Although it is a loosely defined video game genre, I think computer RPG's must offer a way to customize/build a character and those decisions reflect IN the game (not just in our heads) opening up new gameplay opportunities. The actions and decisions you make must somehow affect the game world, and people should react accordingly.

Japanese RPG's are barely RPG's by my standards, but at least they do have very strong story telling and the combat is traditionally based on planning/tactics. Chrono Trigger does have a couple of things where you can affect the world: Whether Luca's mom lives or not, and whether or not you restore the desert by leaving Robo in the past. Very rudimentary, but at least they are there. JRPG is probably a different genre altogether.

Chromie92 said:

I love the Zelda series but come on they are action/adventure games if anything. ›››

Exactly! Action/adventure. Not even pure adventure, since you do have to rely on reflex-based mechanics to perform actions.

Pure adventure would be simply that: exploration and discovery. Like point-and-click graphical adventures.

freakie1one said:

I've never been one to be picky over what genre or category a game falls under because ultimately I consider it to be of little consequence ›››

You are wise

In the end, what matters is that we do something we enjoy.


PS: But Zelda is not an RPG Same goes for most of the games in that magazine *ducks for imminent blows*

[VonStreff]

Yeah, Zelda could or could not be classified as an RPG. A note on the Kickstarter: it's a mockup, so the articles represented there aren't the finals, they're just placeholders.

Good discussion though, I should send the guy in charge a link to this thread!

[slimgrin]

Can't say I see Zelda as an RPG.

[.Volsung.]

VonStreff said:

Yeah, Zelda could or could not be classified as an RPG. A note on the Kickstarter: it's a mockup, so the articles represented there aren't the finals, they're just placeholders.

Good discussion though, I should send the guy in charge a link to this thread! ›››

It's clearly a mockup, but makes you wonder why they named the magazine like that when they obviously focus on a wider style of games. I mean, seriously, Borderlands?

I like their layout and concept, it looks like a magazine I'd read. But the name is clearly too restrictive. They should just name it "games we like" or something like that

["The White Wolf"]

There are very many different interpretations of what a role-playing game is, if you just call it a game where you play a role, well that is every game, is you call it something where you have different roles to play, that narrows it down a little bit, I like to classify an RPG as something with an own environment, an open world almost, free-roam, and in this environment you have a main quest line and other side quests, you can make choices. I believe that a role playing game is anything where you can realistically assume that this is a real person, you can go where you want, make real life decisions and maybe even get a feel for the character.

[arkblazer]

I would disagree that C&C is what identifies a game as an RPG, if so then games that have C&C is an rpg? i mean visual novels have C&C are they rpg's? what about starcraft 2, that had C&C, is that an rpg? what about gear of wars and the latest call of duty, didnt those had C&C? by the same account there are JRPGS that were pretty straight forward and had little, to no C&C like breath of fire 4 or final fantasy tactics.

A good identifier is what its use in extra credits in their videos about JRPGS vs WRPGS, which isn't what a gameplay mechanic that identifies it an rpg but what you are looking for in a game.

http://penny-arcade....ese-rpgs-part-1

[.Volsung.]

I'd say we close the whole "X game is not an RPG" thing because we're obviously not getting anywhere, and it's completely unrelated to this thread. There was already a "What is an RPG?" thread going on if you guys want to keep arguing about apples vs. oranges.

PS: Zelda is still not an RPG

[slimgrin]

arkblazer said:

I would disagree that C&C is what identifies a game as an RPG, if so then games that have C&C is an rpg? i mean visual novels have C&C are they rpg's? what about starcraft 2, that had C&C, is that an rpg? what about gear of wars and the latest call of duty, didnt those had C&C? by the same account there are JRPGS that were pretty straight forward and had little, to no C&C like breath of fire 4 or final fantasy tactics.

A good identifier is what its use in extra credits in their videos about JRPGS vs WRPGS, which isn't what a gameplay mechanic that identifies it an rpg but what you are looking for in a game.

http://penny-arcade....ese-rpgs-part-1 ›››

Penny arcade is the most insipid and pathetic example of game journalism. It's the last example I'd use.

[.Volsung.]

slimgrin said:

Penny arcade is the most insipid and pathetic example of game journalism. It's the last example I'd use. ›››

I thought they were just having fun, never considered them journalists. So yeah, I suppose we agree on that.